Bill would let permit holders take guns into restaurants with alcohol


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Submitted: Thu, 01/31/2013 - 4:24am
Updated: Thu, 01/31/2013 - 1:18pm
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WILMINGTON, NC (WWAY) — How well do guns and alcohol mix? A new bill in the General Assembly would allow people with concealed carry permits into restaurants where alcohol is served.

This is not the first time gun activists have pushed for this bill, but with recent debate on gun rights, not everyone thinks it’s a good idea.

“I think that if a person is legally entitled to carry a concealed weapon, I don’t think the location matters as much as a person with a weapon,” said Ricci Wright, the store manager at Shooter’s Choice in Wilmington.

The concern for many is if guns and alcohol should mix.

“As far as introducing alcohol in the situation, on the surface that sounds bad, but those same folks are driving back and forth to those restaurants, so assuming they have control of their intake of alcohol whether or not legally impaired for driving an automobile I’m assuming they have the same responsibility for their weapon,” Ricci said.

Others disagree. They say just like having a designated driver, you should have a designated gun holder.

“As far as someone you know, someone being able to bring a loaded weapon into a restaurant where people are drinking, I don’t think it’s a very good idea,” bartender Andrew Flynn said.

Many question if this will keep people safer. One supporter of the bill says it’s OK only if the restaurant owner allows it.

“If you have the right to bear arms, I think it becomes upon the owner of the establishment whether he wants you in or out with a weapon,” Thomas Russell said. “But you should have the right to carry a weapon all times, except where someone says you can’t that owns the building.”

Advocates argue that restaurants that serve alcohol are spots where law abiding gun owners are vulnerable to criminals.

The bill would also keep the names of concealed carry permit holders from being public information.

43 Comments

  • SurfCityTom says:

    clear questions?

    But wait. IN another post you referred to Durham.

    It seems one of the ballpark proponents referred numerous times to Durham achievements as the supporting basis on which the city of Wilnmington should have pledged millions in bond dollars to build an unneeded baseball diamond.

    Are you that same person hiding under a new identity?

    If my posts are so boring, you seem the only one with that opinion, why not do the intelligent thing and not read them. But that may be above your grade level.

    Have a good day Chuckles

  • Vog46 says:

    Here try this:
    http://ncleg.net/gascripts/BillLookUp/BillLookUp.pl?Session=2013&BillID=H17

    Look at the primary sponsor – click on his name:

    http://ncleg.net/gascripts/members/viewMember.pl?sChamber=H&nUserID=661

    The internet is a dangerous thing……
    Actually that’s a pretty good link that everyone should know about.

    Vog

  • Guest12345678 says:

    This is such a terrible idea. It’s mind-numbing. When did Americans become so scared of their own shadows? What? Can’t you just go out, have a few beers, and pop Viagra?

  • Guest 211 says:

    HEAVENS NO. I DON’T GO OUT TO EAT MUCH ANYMORE ANY WAY. ESPECIALLY AT NITE. GUESS IF THAT BILLS PASSED, IT WILL BE O.

  • bjones says:

    When you post news like this it would be very interesting to know exactly who sponsored the bill. I realize that the days of investigative reporting are prtty much dead, but it would also be good to know which group gives them money.

  • GuestTBagger says:

    Tom, can’t you write a single post without a disconnected reference to “entitlement recipients”? Your script is becoming tiresomely boring.

  • wideNCawake says:

    …nothing like going to a bar with a well armed militia!

  • Guesttenheimer says:

    …to hear all of the rediculous, know-it-all comments that will arise from this article!

    Vog, you’re first (as usual).

    SurfCityTom, next in line (used to always be first prior to Vog).

  • Guest Reply says:

    What if they are just going to pick up a Take Out order? Does that count too?

  • Vog46 says:

    I was first.
    Of course we’re talking CONCEALED carry here not a permit to own.
    Vog

  • Who cares.. Its like a CDL license. The real danger is the dumb asses with 4 wheels drunk with guns. Dont understand with all the hype .. See it more on the Highway than at Pizza Hut or Tony Roma’s

  • Guest Reply says:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JX1qQ4j7GEY

    Did they have, or have not, a license? Enough said…..

  • Guest000000 says:

    Only if they have a designated shooter.

  • SurfCityTom says:

    you made more ridiculous comments than either Vog or I are capable of.

    If you’re for or against the bill, have you contacted your local representative to let them know your position? Probably not as that would take an intelligent effort and communication skills of a 4th grader.

    Keep up the good work. I have better things to do then educate the entitlement recipients.

    I did not see you in Raleigh this week for the opening sessions of the Legislature.

    You have a chance to make a difference; but creating a legible email for your state representatives is likely beyond you.

  • GuestMan. says:

    You see, it’s that 1 per cent that should cause alarm. That’s just what we need: a bunch of drunks with guns in bars. All it takes is just one person and then the rest of us are screwed.

  • Citizen of the Republic says:

    People with a concealed carry permit are not allowed to consume alcohol, or take illegal drugs, or take more legal drugs than allowed by a doctor while carrying a firearm.

    If someone is drinking in a bar, and carrying a weapon, he won’t have that permit for very long. There are many rules regarding concealed carry, and 99% of permit holders follow them to the letter.

  • Vog46 says:

    “But of course, if you are carrying concealed properly–key word being concealed–how is someone going to know you are carrying?”

    My point exactly.
    If you conceal effectively who’s gonna know you’re drinking while carrying?. IN a CCW case there’s no legal limit – it’s ANY alcohol – but if they can’t see the weapon – who will REALLY care?
    Alcohol and drugs are addictive which means people will find excuses to use them.
    I WANT to believe Guesttenheimer that people who have CCW’s are responsible law abiding citizens because MOST of them are – but we’ve seen repeatedly that this is in fact NOT the case.
    Smart people do dumb things – and alcohol and drugs change perceptions as to what people “can get away with”.

    Vog

  • Guesttenheimer says:

    CCP holders are taught the law as part of their training. They are taught when and where they are allowed to carry. Businesses posting “No concealed firearms allowed” mean that. A CCP holder that disregards that posting would be an idiot and would be subject to a misdemeanor if caught. A “misdemeanor” will not necessarily get your permit pulled. It depends on the classification of the misdemeanor, the severity and if violence were involved. In general though, it is advisable to obey the law to the best of your ability and avoid any infractions.

    What is the purpose of your hypothetical scenarios? If you were aware of the CCP regulations as you state, you would know these answers. CCP holders do.

    I’m not sure of your reference to a “gun permit”. The only “permit” I’m aware of is the purchase permit that one applies for with the County Sheriff and is required for a weapons purchase from an FFL. A “permit” is not required to buy from an individual in a person to person sale.

  • VOG466 says:

    HELLO MY NAME IS VOG> i KNOW ALIITLE ABOUT EVERYTHING. THANKS FOR LISTENING

    VOG

  • B M says:

    the long and short answer to the question you posed to Vog—–“YES”

  • GuestVader says:

    Vog…were you born that stupid or did you take lessons?

  • jsmith says:

    Actually, a permit IS required for a personal sale:

    Article 52A.
    Sale of Weapons in Certain Counties.
    ยง 14-402. Sale of certain weapons without permit forbidden.
    (a) It is unlawful for any person, firm, or corporation in this State to sell, give away, or transfer, or to purchase or receive, at any place within this State from any other place within or without the State any pistol unless: (i) a license or permit is first obtained under this Article by the purchaser or receiver from the sheriff of the county in which the purchaser or receiver resides; or (ii) a valid North Carolina concealed handgun permit is held under Article 54B of this Chapter by the purchaser or receiver who must be a resident of the State at the time of the purchase.

  • Guest Reply says:

    “IF my sister were a man, she would be my brother”…(Unquote)

    That’s kinda like…If a gay guy and a Lesbian got married, and had kids…would they, to society, be……%$^*%&^%$*$_)(*&(?

  • Vog46 says:

    I am well aware of the CCP rules. Thats why I said gun permit not CCP
    So let me ask a question.
    According to the proposed regulation a restaurant can post conspicuous “No guns allowed” in his or her business.
    A person with a CCP gets caught – no alcohol in his system and is charged with a misdeamnor for bringing a concealed weapon in there.
    A person charged with a misdemeanor also loses his CCP.
    Correct?
    Vog

  • jsmith says:

    Without checking the current laws for an exact quote, I believe that a first offense misdemeanor gives you the choice of a fine or relinquishing your permit…

    Also, carrying in an establishment that is posted no carry I believe is trespassing–if you don’t leave and they call law enforcement you might get charged.

    But of course, if you are carrying concealed properly–key word being concealed–how is someone going to know you are carrying?

  • Vog46 says:

    I am also not disagreeing with you – It’s just that not all CCW permit holders are “good guys” JUST because they got their permit – to believe that is naive.
    Lets say a good law abiding citizen decides to lock up his gun and smoke some pot. If that pot is detected in his/her system they would lose their CCW permit.
    So if a CCW permit holder NEVER gets checked but continues to smoke pot or drink (the cops have to have a reason to check) is he still a good guy?
    He may be but he is breaking the letter of the law.
    My concern is that the general level of responsibility of most folks has dropped and many of us believe that we are somehow above the law (albeit slightly) because we have a CCW permit. It’s this nagging suspicion that just because someone has a CCW they will stay on the straight and narrow that I find so unbelievable.
    (I’m overly suspicious by nature)

    Vog

  • Vog46 says:

    You’d be the one dispensing the NRA kool aid.
    First and foremost as I said in my initial post (yeah the first one) I cringe at the thought of combining alcohol and guns in the same place.
    Not because I fear the people carrying legally – for the most part they are just like me.
    No arrests
    No priors
    No drugs
    Don’t drink in public and very little at home
    Don’t smoke except an occasional cigar
    Basically your church goin, God Fearin, Bible reading, old timer.
    Do I need a gun? Probably not – certainly not to protect me. I’ve lead a full life so dying later today isn’t a big thing for me to worry about.
    Gun violence is a useless thing in my mind – whether its to kill or rob. A gun gives a bad guy a false sense of “bravado”. So – why tempt fate?
    Do “no gun zones” tempt bad guys? Schools? NO shooters in schools tend to be mental cases – these are not typically bad guys they’re sick guys.
    So what tempts bad guys?
    Money. What do restaurants have? Money. Do I need to defend THAT restaurant against a robber? Nope – not my job and I sure don’t want to be caught in the cross fire between a bad guy and someone who believes it’s his God given right to shoot back across MY table while I’m enjoying a darned good steak….
    I’m glad they gave the business owner’s the right to REFUSE to allow guns in their place of business. Thats a place I want to go eat at.
    Vog

  • Guesttenheimer says:

    You and I sound quite similar. I am not an NRA member and haven’t had their koolaid, but I am a qualified CCP holder, a gun collector and love to target shoot anytime I get the opportunity. I also promote the safe handling and use of firearms by law-abiding citizens and especially with women these days. I personally do not regularly carry a concealed weapon on my person and don’t feel the need to. I do travel with one neatly and conveniently tucked away. My evening jaunts passing the “crime-free” downtown alleys will find me well prepared as well.
    I don’t have a need to carry a weapon into a restaurant here albeit Durham was quite different and somewhat necessary. I’m just not worried about it here. Money in restaraunts? Yeah, there’s a little, but liquor stores, and banks have much more! We can’t carry one in those places, it’s illegal, except for the one’s that don’t care…the criminals!

  • jsmith says:

    I guess you don’t ever have to walk from the restaurant to your car? And you never eat downtown where you are exquisitely safe walking between the restaurant and the parking deck? And the parking deck has such excellent video surveillance security and law enforcement presence that you are 100% safe?

    I’m really surprised that you miss the point…

  • Guesttenheimer says:

    First of all, this article has nothing to do with criminals. It soley about law abiding, mentally competent, rap sheet free, concealed carry permitted citizens and allowing certain additional permissions to them. That’s it. Period. So why introduce the criminal element, the mental case element, illegal drug use and the NRA’s argument against such? Those issues are in no way relative to this article or the proposed bill in any form or fashion.

    We all know WHAT criminals are. We all know what criminals do. We all know that most criminals know the law better than most attorneys and we all know that criminals DO NOT obey the law (that’s how they achieved this status: CRIMINAL).

    CCP holders are confirmed “good guys” totally void of the criminal element and lacking of any known mental condition. CCP holders are not allowed to consume ANY alcohol while carrying a firearm. CCP holders are required to competently follow the defined rules and conditions of the use of deadly force. These CCP holders are the ONLY people this bill is introduced to allow. Not criminals.

  • truthseeker says:

    I support this effort completely and will certainly carry my concealed weapon inside. If a person goes through a thorough background check, pays the required fees, demonstrates safety and knowledge of guns then only a very few places should be off limits. This is a right, not a priviledge given by our fore fathers and I intend to use that right!

  • GuestAgain says:

    We could just fund another 125 Deputies
    To be posted in all the bars and restaurants when they’re open for buisness. Who sponsored this nonsense?

  • VoiceOfReason says:

    Do you really think there are only 125 restaurants in Wilmington that serve alcohol? The number has to be closer to 500 or more. If you’re going to participate in the gun control discussion, please be rational. Are you suggesting that the deputies would be necessary to oversee the concealed carry permit holders who are eating lunch or dinner? Are you projecting your fears upon those folks, thinking that they’d shoot somebody if their sandwich was missing a pickle?

  • Vog46 says:

    I don’t know if you were responding to me or the article in general.
    If a criminal has no concept of “law” and obtains a gun – which is the MAIN argument by the NRA, do you think a restriction on alcoholic consumption would have any effect on them?
    Another argument made by the NRA is mental illness and the treatment for these diseases. Mood altering drugs impair perception (which is one reason why the mentally ill are supposedly prevented from getting guns).
    Alcohol does too.
    As a person with a CCP I know that
    Criminals get guns and
    Criminals don’t care about restrictions on alcohol

    That said, I don’t believe the risk is worth it.
    Vog

  • jsmith says:

    I may have missed it in the article, but you do know that the person carrying would NOT be allowed to consume any alcohol, right?

    Do you know that under current law, a concealed permit holder may NOT have ANY alcohol in their system while carrying concealed.

    You all did know that, right??

  • Vog46 says:

    I cringe at the thought of having guns and alcohol together in the same place.
    If you can get stopped for DWI and lose your license for repeat offenses then you should lose your gun permit as well.
    Vog

  • Guesttenheimer says:

    Law abiding and responsible CCP holders are prohibited from drinking ANY alcohol while carrying concealed.

    A person will not be granted a CCP if they have outstanding, current or multiple DWI convictions.

    “IF” a CCP holder even gets charged (not convicted) with a DWI, that CCP is automatically revoked on the spot. There’s no “IF” in this equation, it’s the law.

    It is a specifically and heavily emphasized point of the CCP instruction that firearms and alcohol are to never be combined and is fully prohibited as a requirement of holding the CCP.

    See Vog, there actually ARE responsible people in this world that do the right thing, obey the law and are outstanding citizens. We don’t hear about them simply because of that fact. The media will not publish acts of good will by law abiding citizens because it just doesn’t contain the shock factor that makes them money. It’s only the criminals creating mayhem that they sensationalize in the news these days. So, don’t cringe too much or chip your teeth from chattering. It’ll be okay and you don’t have to hide in the dark, obscure corner of the restaurant to enjoy your dinner, no matter what they tell you.

  • jsmith says:

    I don’t know why it’s so difficult for people to obtain and report on FACTS.

    Article 54B (referenced section in proposed bill)

    (c2) It shall be unlawful for a person, with or without a permit, to carry a concealed handgun while consuming alcohol or at any time while the person has remaining in the person’s body any alcohol or in the person’s blood a controlled substance previously consumed, but a person does not violate this condition if a controlled substance in the person’s blood was lawfully obtained and taken in therapeutically appropriate amounts or if the person is on the person’s own property.

    Further, the bill addresses carry in RESTAURANTS that serve alcohol–NOT BARS.

  • B M says:

    I don’t think the majority of people voting no and upset with allowing concealed carry in restaurants know much about having the license, point being with any alcohol in your system your permit is null and void and fixin to land the holder in some serious trouble, also the bill isn’t aimed at “bars”, it is talking about “restaurants” that serve alcohol, big difference.

  • ILM permit holder says:

    Yes, they should be able to carry as long as their are not drinking any alcoholic beverages!

    Businesses should take down their “no guns allowed” signs as this tells the criminals that no one can defend themselves on premise.

  • WriteRight says:

    So that’s why I always secure my weapon in my vehicle, go in for dinner etc, NOT DRINK and come back to my vehicle and holster my weapon. You see, I’m a LAW ABIDING CITIZEN that values my permit to carry. It is for the above scenario that I DO NOT patronize any establishments in downtown Wilmington. The law is clear. There is ZERO tolerance for alcohol when carrying a concealed weapon. Why is it so hard for people to understand that criminals actually do not follow the law? Am I missing something? So if allowed by law to carry in a place that serves alcohol, I STILL won’t drink. Why? See above.

  • GuestUSMC says:

    My wife and I both have a CCP. I don’t believe it is a good idea to consume alcohol and carry a handgun. I do believe it would be fine to carry concealed in a restaurant that serves alcohol as long as the permit holder was not consumeing alcohol himself.

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