As the battle over health care reform rages on in Washington, community members continue to fight for health care here in Wilmington.
Many local organizations, including Cape Fear Citizens for Health Care and RISE Community gathered at Hugh MacRae Park Sunday urging citizens to get involved and support reform.
Supporters say that the time for change is now, and that health insurance reform is a big problem that is going to require a big change to fix.
“I understand the concern. It's a huge problem. It's a huge issue,” said Allie Nardella of RISE Community. “And so it is going to require a great change, but it's a change that needs to happen. We really need to do this now, and again, what are we waiting for? If not now, when?”
The event featured live music and food. It was part of the kick-off for the National Hands Across America for Healthcare campaign.


Take the "What's In Reform for You" Quiz
Here's what YOU will get out of healthcare reform. Take the quiz and learn the truth.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/realitycheck/quiz/?e=12&ref=text
Sure! Trust Obama, Pelosi, and Reid
The White House quiz is simply more of the same previously digested vagueness and false promises. It's political, not scientific, and is not based upon the facts contained in any of the pending bills.
READ THE BILLS, PEOPLE! Start with H.R. 3200. You'll be shocked!
H.R. 3200
Have read the whole, eye-glazing thing. Wasn't "shocked". Why are you?
If you're not shocked...
...you are either unconscious, totally unaware of the concepts of freedom and liberty, or simply subscribe to the theory that the government should run everything.
The bill is nothing but shopping list of the government's FIRST steps in taking over your health care. Obama gets outraged over all the claims that he says aren't in the bill, but what he DOESN'T mention is how the vagueness and nebulous nature of the bill will allow judges and appointed bureaucrats decide policy and processes that will allow most of those horror stories that are not in the bill to become a reality in short order.
I invite everyone to read H.R. 3200. Here's a link that offers the bill in its entirety, along with some concerns that are being raised. This IS a partisan website, so don't automatically take it as gospel. Read the bill, read the concern, make up your mind.
http://www.conservativerepublicansoftexas.com/0/2128329/0/20033/
If you....
If you think public schools, the VA, public fire and police protection are "socialist": then oppose health care reform
If you enjoy getting double digit increases to your health insurance plan: Then oppose health care reform
If you prefer getting less salary/wages because your employer has to pay more for health insurance every year: Then oppose health care reform
If you think it’s a bad thing for individuals to discuss living wills and end of life care with their doctor: Then oppose health care reform
If you think it’s a good thing that you pay higher insurance premiums to inefficiently subsidize the uninsured: Then oppose health care reform
If you are genuinely concerned about the federal deficit, does it bother you to know that health care costs currently eat up 16% of GDP, and will be 20% of GDP in just 8 short years? If not, then by all means, oppose health care reform.
If you are genuinely a believer in the “free market” and competition, are you aware that health insurance companies are exempt from the Sherman Anti-Trust act, and therefore CAN collude, and CAN have monopolies? Is that really the “free market” at work?
If you think the government is going to ration care, are you aware that the “free market” currently forces patients to wait for results on cancer biopsies and cancer treatments before getting treated to make sure their insurance can cover their treatment? Do you think those patients are getting “the best possible care” right now, having to wait for cancer treatments?
If you like the fact that our country has worse mortality and morbidity compared to every other industrialized country, and pays more for the privilege of those worse outcomes, then by all means, oppose health care reform.
If Canada, France and England have such a bad health care system, then why aren’t they clamoring for their politicians to institute an “American style” health insurance system?
If you are religious in any religion, do you believe “Love your neighbor as yourself?” If you love yourself enough to care for your own body, do you love others as your God or your Savior commanded you to, and are you willing to help them? If not, perhaps consider a religion that doesn’t ask you to sacrifice for others.
If you do not wish to have government sponsored health care for yourself, then by all means, say no. But please stop trying to prevent the option for those that do.
Nice
Very well put....
Reply to If you
If you want socialized medicine, that is fine with me. I have no intention of trying to stop anyone from obtaining socialized medicine. It is not up to me to dictate what kind of healthcare you or anyone else has. I reiterate DICTATE. Which is what Obama and his minions are doing. I do not want it - I take offense that I would most likely be forced to take it. My issue is that I do not want to be forced to take part in this. The government needs to keep out of things they know nothing about. Example - the car business. I really do not think the Cash for Clunkers worked out very well since the government owes dealers thousands upon thousands of dollars. I don't want to take part in any 'business' run by the government. At least a government headed up by Obama. God help us.
Nice try, but no religion on Earth....
...commands us to give our money to the government first, to take care of our fellow man. I give away thousands every year. Let the government try to step in as a middle man and my checkbook will slam shut like it's spring loaded!
Take the time to look at health care in Canada, the UK, and France before you preach its virtue: Thousands of Canadians coming to this country for treatment. The UK negotiating with private insurers to assist in making National Health more affordable for the Crown. France thinking of raising taxes even above their current punitive rate because their healthcare system is so expensive.
Your entire post is nothing but rhetorical silliness until we reach the last paragraph. At that point it decends into total nonsense, because as everyone who has read the bill knows, YOU CAN'T SAY NO TO OBAMACARE IF IT PASSES!
The good news is that most of your countrymen are saying no NOW, before it passes.
Can you believe this?
This an example of why we must sever the link between health insurance and employers.
David Shepardson at the Detroit News writes:
Northville-based wheel producer Hayes Lemmerz International Inc. wants permission to pay more than $10 million in bonuses, including as much as $6.7 million to its top five execs.
Just Friday, however, Hayes proposed canceling its retiree health and life insurance coverage for households covering 2,200 families. That move could save the company $140 million. Hayes bankruptcy plan also assumes the government's insurer will pick up its underfunded pension plan. ...
In the meantime, Hayes has proposed creating a Voluntary Employee Beneficiary Association, which would allow retirees who are ineligible for Medicare to keep coverage at a cost of $900 to $2,100 a month. Hayes would contribute as much as $4.8 million over four years to cancel its accrued liability of $147.5 million.
tell the whole story
What drove them into bankruptcy? Which union sucked them dry?
The mediocre performers never do like bonus-based compensation, do they? They might have to work to get a bonus!
The rest of the story...
What drove them into bankruptcy?
Obviously it was inept management. They are the ones who are responsible for revenue generation and expense control. Evidently they failed.
Right you are!
It was weak management who dared not stand up to the thugs at the UAW, who for years and years bled them dry under threat of strike. (You skipped that part.)
In other words, the UAW members and retirees who are losing their healthcare and pension played the biggest part in killing their own golden goose - union greed, the terminal disease for industry.
No Obamacare
All of these posts really crack me up people! Am I overweight - yes I am but that is my business. Am I gainfully employed - yes I am (for the moment). Do I pay for my healthcare through my employer - yes I do. Do I want government-run healthcare - absolutely not! I have always had healthcare and have never had any health issues with me being overweight. BESIDES, IT IS NO ONE'S BUSINESS BUT MY OWN. I am telling you people - be afraid, be very afraid of Obama and his minions. They will force you to take part on Obamacare - the cost of this care will be drafted out of your bank account. As far as I am concerned, that is illegal, but I'm telling you, Obama and his minions want to control everything about your life. Get a grip and see through your rose colored, foggy glasses. Most of us have a hard enough time making ends meet without paying for the care of others. This is lunacy - WAKE UP AMERICA!
Has anyone else noticed?
When you ask the Obama crowd how they plan on paying for health care reform, they never respond and just shut up.
My theory is that they have absolutely no idea or want to remain silent to prevent you from hearing their plans to loot the productive half of society. That's what Boortz calls them looters!
Sedentary lifestyle
It seems the sedentary lifestyle of the liberal with their arms held out in a palm up position is what is causing all this. If everyone were to work, pay for their own healthcare, take care of themselves (not get fat and lazy), and take responsibility for their actions, then I think this great country would be in a better position. But, since we have those of you refuse to take resposibility for ANY action they have, then it is up to the rest of us to support the fat and lazy liberal, who expect entitlements and handOUTs. If the fat and lazy liberals had to pay once in a while and DO something (other than mooch off society), then I think they would realize what a raw deal they are giving to everyone else.
Also, I agree with the others who have posted that if the US Government cannot manage social security, then why should we entrust them with our HealthCare.
From Capitalism to Socialism in 8 months. Thank you for your horrible change Mr. Obama. You are not a real president to me until you decide to listen to the people and not cherry pick what you want to hear.
Wish I'd heard about this sooner!
What a great cause! I wish Americans could come together and support adequate healthcare for all citizens in our great country.
LOL
THERE IS adequate health care available to ALL citizens of this great country...you just have to actually WORK to get it...HUuuuhhh...I know..SHOCKER...you actually have to DO WORK...
Work!?!
No way! Obuma promised me that if I voted for him I wouldn't have to do anything for myself. The government is supposed to take care of all my wants and needs. Work is for suckers.
Wonderful dream
Who pays for it?
Pay for your own healthcare. It's not my responsibility.
Fix it!
Why do you assume that everyone supporting reform expects someone else to pay? Clearly you don't understand how the current system functions. Let me explain.
Estimates are that it costs between $550 - $750/mo. to pay for health insurance. Many employers subsidize 75% (or more) of the cost and the employee pays the balance, or about $150 - $190/mo. If you quit your job, you can keep COBRA coverage for 102% of the cost to your former employer, or $$560 - $765/mo.
Those are GROUP rates. If you then have to buy an individual policy, the rates are SIGNIFICANTLY higher to begin with since you don't have the bargaining power of a large group. After you submit an application, you will be charged a rate which is 1 to 7 times the published rate, depending on your history and POSSIBLE future health expenses.
Whereas employers can demand that pre-existing conditions be covered, you have no such bargaining power. EVERY DOCTOR VISIT prior to submitting that application is now a pre-existing condition and you will be charged for it, as well as what COULD happen in the future. It doesn't matter how long you've been insured previously. There is no portability of insuranace.
Also, if you get sick, the insurer will find a way to cancel your policy (recission). Again, this doesn't usually happen with larger GROUP policies.
The current bills put an end to recission and pre-existing conditions, and eliminate pricing based on factors other than age. These protections need to be implemented now. Many workers are losing their jobs. Once COBRA runs out, many will find they can't get insurance. (In NC all but 1 company can, and will, deny coverage. After all, they didn't get your prior premiums...why should they pay now?)
US companies have a burden of health insurance that foreign companies do not. To be competitive internationally, the US must eliminate employer paid health insurance. If not, jobs will continue to be offshored or US companies will eventually discontinue health benefits. Reform is needed now and is supported by the US Chamber of Commerce.
Surprise, surprise!
Another one claiming that those of us who oppose Obamacare "just don't understand." Trust me pal, I didn't get to where I am today by not understanding how things work.
Let me state this once again - I fully support anti-recission legislation. Insurance is about risk and they should not be allowed to cancel just because they gambled wrong.
I am, however, 100% opposed to making an insurance company accept any pre-existing condition if they have to place you in the same cost structure as people without pre-existing conditions. They are not charities, they are businesses trying to earn a profit. If you have a pre-existing condition, you SHOULD pay more! You are a higher risk.
As far as the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, yes, they support reform, but tell the WHOLE truth. They do NOT support reform as it is currently envisioned by the Socialists in Congress and the White House.
http://www.chamberpost.com/2009/08/health-reform-rhetoric-and-reality.html
Re: Surprise, Surprise
In response to several of your comments:
1. You certainly make assumptions that are not substantiated by facts. Your biases obviously cloud your perception of the world around you. For example, you said, "Why, by the time COBRA had expired, had you not found another job?" How did you conclude that I was unemployed? That is inaccurate, but consistent with your other comment, "So will you feel better if I say, "...lazy, inept, and mixed up on their financial priorities?" It appears that you believe that all the uninsured are lazy and irresponsible. That's hardly the case. For example, my wife and I each have advanced degrees and have been employed for our entire adult lives.
2. You said, "Pay for your own healthcare. It's not my responsibility." Webster defines insurance as a "contract by which one party agrees to guarantee or indemnify another against loss by a specified contingent event or peril." It is a shared risk concept. If you'd prefer not to participate, then don't. However, it's not a one-way street. Don't expect the rest of us to protect you if you aren't willing to reciprocate.
Furthermore, 40% of Americans do not have employer-paid health insurance. Why are they required to subsidize your insurance premiums via the tax code? Since employee insurance premiums are a form of income that is not taxed, 40% of Americans (many of whom are poor) are subsidizing the other 60% (many of whom are financially well off).
3. You said, "You cannot expect insurance companies to accept pre-existing conditions that guarantee an endless stream of red ink somewhere in the future." In reality, they do already. Most folks participate in GROUP plans that accept those with pre-existing conditions. It's already priced into those plans. The Congressional Republicans support this concept of portability. Even the Chamber of Commerce has endorsed it. "... the Chamber supports some of the proposals currently before Congress, such as ...guaranteed coverage without regard to preexisting conditions,..."
This issue is not only about expensive illnesses. Preexisting conditions include such conditions as being overweight, having high blood pressure and having high cholesterol. Individually these conditions may not result in denial of coverage, but in combination they will result in higher premiums, denial of coverage or a waiver for specific conditions. A Star-News article recently stated that lower back pain is a common condition that can lead to denial of coverage.
The "consumer protections" in the various bills (end to rescission, accepting those with preexisting conditions, and eliminating pricing based on factors other than age) have been agreed to by both sides of the aisle. This is simply an issue of fairness. Why should those who have been insured for their entire life find themselves without health insurance simply because their insurance company went out of business, they changed jobs, or they moved to another state? Is the current system fair to the tens of thousands of salaried retirees of the automobile companies and their parts suppliers? They now live with the fear that their health insurance will be cancelled before they are eligible for Medicare.
I have deliberately not addressed the emotional issue of helping those who are too poor to afford health insurance. All I can say is that one's position on that subject is a reflection of the compassion within their soul.
So if you both have advanced degrees....
...and you've both been employed all your lives, you must have saved quite a nestegg, no? Good. Use it to pay for your health needs.
If you don't like the tax code's treatment of health insurance, CHANGE THE TAX CODE! Don't try to reinvent America into some European Socialist Utopia where we all get the same medicre, marginal treatment.
There are MANY ways we could make healthcare work better in this country, but unfortunately the Socialists won't get off their "all things for all people" bandwagon. That's why Obamacare as envisioned is dead. Too many promises, too many unanswered questions, too much deception, and too few people paying for it.
Let's go over the humanitarian issue one last time. It is **MY** job to help my fellow man. Jesus told **ME** to do that. He didn't appoint Caeser as my proxy, and I don't need a bloated, inefficient bureaucracy deciding where my charity should go.
Nice
I would love to see you scramble if your work told you "Pay for your own healthcare. It's not my responsibility." I bet your holier than thou attitude would change then........
I'm sure they hate paying most of your insurance for you as well.......
It's called "managing your own finances and life."
Well, due to contractual terms it's a near impossibility, but if I lost my insurance coverage I would then pay for my own healthcare needs.
Next!
I
I am very happy you have the luxury to afford your own insurance. I am lucky in that aspect too. Some americans are not. Before you start spewing your bit about they should have gone to college or taken care of their money better, realize for every one of those who have all those things, their are 10 who have to work at the restaurants you eat at. Their are the men and women working at the gas station. These jobs are necessary. They don't pay a lot. Are the people at these jobs "lazy" and "inept" like you seem to think anyone who can't afford the outrageous cost private insurance rates?
Let's go over this once again
Fully one-half of the estimated 45 million uninsured Americans are uninsured because they CHOOSE to spend their income on items other than health insurance.
So will you feel better if I say, "...lazy, inept, and mixed up on their financial priorities?"
Some don't CHOOSE to spend
Some don't CHOOSE to spend their income on other things! Some put housing and feeding their family first. Sometimes there isn't enough even for that. Some work 40hrs a week, some even work overtime. Some aren't lazy, inept, or mixed up on their financial priorities. Some just don't get paid enough to service people like you!
So, if you are that poor...
..why are you having children?
Here's a thought: Poor people can't afford everything rich people can.
We should ALL live within our means. In other word's, it's not the government's job to make your life better. It's YOUR job.
Pay for your own healthcare!
It's amazing that while the aniti-Obamacare crowd can spit out numbers and figures to shoot down this fiscal nightmare, the pro-Socialist crowd can only chant, "We need change, now."
BTW, I saw that group on Sunday and assure you that the best reform most of them could make to their healthcare would be to lose fifty pounds or so.
health care
I am amazed that someone using the web name common sense lacks any.How Can you defend the insurance industry? Obviously, you need some care for your poor vision because you were not looking at the many healthy doctors, nurses,construction and beauty salon business owners and scientist to name but a few that were in attendance.Do you dare suggest that there are not any unhealthy, over weight people opposing health care reform? Do you think social security, medicaid/medicare and military health care all provided by the government are socialist programs? Your narrow-minded hate tactics do nothing to create a solution to the problems brought to bear by years of doing nothing.Your comments are common alright, but they demonstrate your lack of sense
Why is the insurance industry fault?
Why is the insurance industry fault? Have you seen what the doctors charge? How about the Hospital? I got an itemize bill from HMRMC and they charged me $7.00 for one aspirin and 120.00 for a doctor’s visit (that lasted all of ten minutes). So, if the insurance company has to cover this type of chargers (and yes they are in business to make money) they have to charge their customer. Why is not the President and Congress trying to reduce health care cost? Maybe, it is the money. If the Insurance Industry padded their pockets then they would not be the scrape goat..
If this plan is so good, why do not hear Congress or the President saying they are going to change their coverage to the one they want use to take. Think about it… We already give free housing, free food and free health care to the poor (so they can go out and buy the 150.00 tennis shore and have satellite TV).
Reform Insurance Practices
You'd better hope that you don't lose your job. If you do, you may end up like me. I was insured every second of my life. Once COBRA ran out I was denied coverage by all companies licensed in NC except one. That one has to insure everyone but can charge whatever they want. I was quoted a rate that is 6 times what is shown on their website. Using today's rates, that amounts to $2925.00/month. Add in another $490 for my wife and the total comes to $41,000/year. Can you afford that? (FYI...my condition is managed with a few pills a day and 2 doctor visits per year.)
Surely you are smart enough to know that an aspirin doesn't cost $7.00. How much were you charged for electricity, water, air conditioning, etc? ZERO. It's all in the price of the aspirin. Yes, it is an odd practice, but the cost would be the same however they break it down.
Since you posted this again....
...her's a second chance to answer some questions.
Why, by the time COBRA had expired, had you not found another job?
Has your wife explored the possibilities of seeking employment from a company that will cover her and her dependents?
Have you availed yourself of all the low cost clinics and big-box pharmacies that are springing up? Semi-annual visits to a walk-in clinic and $4.00 generics makes the proprietary drugs your only major expense, and there are even programs to help you pay for those.
In answer to your question, yes, I COULD afford $41k a year, but I would never pay that. I'd simply go without insurance, as many people choose to do. That's not to sound bold or exhibit false bravado, but to emphasize a point I consistently make: If we accept that life isn't fair, how we manage the adversities we face becomes the hallmark of our life. I, for one, will not dedicate a substantial portion of my income to guard against "what if."
"What if" may never come, but if it does I'll accept the consequences of my decision. Let's face it, we're all reaching that same sunset anyway. Far more important than when that arrives is how you live your life, what you accomplish before that.
You cannot expect insurance companies to accept pre-existing conditions that guarantee an endless stream of red ink somewhere in the future. They're insurance companies, not insurance charities. Like every other corporation, they are in business to provide goods or services for a price, and to make money while doing it.
Outlaw dropping someone when they get sick? Sure - I'm 100% behind that. Forcing them to take people with pre-existing conditions at the same rate as everyone else? No way. Your condition is YOUR condition, not mine. Don't expect me to pay more so you can pay less.
Like I said, life's not fair. Here's a key point: The government will never be able to make it fair. YOU have to deal with what life has thrown in your path, and I have no dount that you're capable of doing it. Don't get lazy and expect a bunch of devious, inept politicians to try and solve your problems for you.
malpratice
Malpractice insurance. Look into the cost of that then ask that question.
The price of that is passed on to us. Then we have the shyster lawyers who sue for anything they can think of.
GREAT examples!
Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid - socialist (yes) programs that are underfunded to the tune of $5 TRILLION right now. Social Security destined for financial collapse by 2037 unless we radically restrict the programs or raise taxes to punitive rates...
...and you want to add ANOTHER entitlement?
Who pays for it all? How many free lunches do we hand out before the nation collapses economically under the burden of supporting people too lazy or inept to support themselves?
So
So, I guess when you retire you will not take a penny of social security or any medicare/medicaid?
I have worked since I was 15 and have no problem with my tax money actually doing some good. Why are so many people against people being healthy? I happen to have a few neighbors who have recently lost their jobs due to no fault of their own. They can't afford to pay the insane rates that private companies charge for insurance. They were (and will be again) good tax paying citizens their whole lives.I think they deserve a chance to be healthy. Remember not everyone who is in need is lazy or inept.
Guess again
I've been paying into Social Security for thirty-nine years and will GLADLY accept my check.
Does that make it any less ridiculous a program? Of course not! Return all the money that my employers and I paid in at a 5% interest rate and THEN I'd gladly pass on a monthly check. As long as I'm forced to participate in this lunacy, you can bet that I'm going to collect the money that was taken from me.
Oh, but wait...they don't HAVE any money to allow people to opt out early! They simply have a bunch of IOUs, because Congress has been using the money. According to the Social Security Administration itself, without a major overhaul or infusion of money (i.e., increased taxes) they'll be flat broke with no money to pay out to recipients in twenty-eight years.
Sounds like flim-flamming, phony-baloney accounting to me....and you want your healthcare run by those same people?
I want
I want the 47 million americans who don't have healthcare to have a fighting chance. If that means a government option for them to fall back on....so be it. Whether you realize it or not, you are already paying for the won'ts...this system at least gives the can'ts a chance. I guess you would rather sit on your high horse though while children go without healthcare because their parents "Can't" afford it. Of course I have learned to take most of what you say with a grain of salt. You were the one who said "Social Security destined for financial collapse by 2037 unless we radically restrict the programs or raise taxes to punitive rates..." While changes will be necessary to keep it going full steam, at the current rate social security will be reduced by close to 25% payouts by then, but not "collapsed" as you put it. Just out of curiosity, were you spewing back up what Glenn Beck, Bill O'Reilly or Sarah Palin told you on that one?
Maybe you should check out www.ssa.gov sometime
Technically their broke now
Every penny social security brings in is sent right back out in benefits or congress steals it from them for general revenue. Every cent is already allocated and it is headed for collapse as everyone admits. Its a ponzi scheme to make Bernie Madoff green with envy because people can't ask for their money back they have to wait for it to be doled out. Too bad there won't be any when I retire so I'm not counting on it.
just as you do
Just as you spew out what obama, kennedy, biden and the other liberal crew sold you on. You were foolish enough to buy it lock stock and barrel.
It depends on your definition of "collapse."
I'd say that when the Social Security Administration has to cut benefits by a full quarter, that's a collapse. You're not getting what you were promised. Remember, too, that that figure was just moved up from last year's report. Will it move again next year? Get closer?
When you also consider the unfunded entitlements and our already existing national debt, you may find that Congress starts reneging on all those IOUs they've handed the Social Security Administration out of necessity. How long before they start telling successful Americans, "You're not getting any of your money?"
(That's when the REAL revolution starts.)
So I'll just sit here on my "high horse" and tell you that I didn't have kids until I knew I could provide for them. They had medical insurance until they left home. *I* took care of my kids, and I'm not Superman.
By the way, if you start a movement to take taxpayer funded care from the "won'ts," I'll support you 100%.
People need to manage their own lives. If they can't or won't, don't try to stick the rest of us with the bill! If you can afford a cell phone and cable, you can afford health insurance.
You can't have everything in life until you can afford it!
...
"People need to manage their own lives. If they can't or won't, don't try to stick the rest of us with the bill! If you can afford a cell phone and cable, you can afford health insurance"- commonsensenotcommontoday
Cable: $70
Cellphone: $60
Health Insurance for two: $450-$500
Commonsense's bad math skills: Priceless
Thanks for a poor attempt
at a MasterCard commercial. I think you need to try again and offer information, not guesses. And while you are at it, please go mow my lawn. That way you can pay your bills.
forgot some
john, you forgot:
2 carton of cigarettes a week: $30x2x4=$240
2 cases of beer a week: $13x2x4= $104
2 NASCAR tickets= $100
john wanting us to pay for others= A joke
If they can find the money for smokes, beer, movies and other entertainment, they can pay for their own insurance.
Oh, please
Don't try to be intentionally obtuse. The point is, if you have a limited income, you have to prioritize your expenditures. Plenty of cable bills exceed $70, and lots of people blow well over $100 a month on cellular phones.
Should I include the rent on that nice apartment and new car payment? Eating out twice a week? Having kids when you don't even have health insurance?
Where, Barney, did you ever get the idea that government was put here to make poor people have everything rich people do? Where is redistribution of wealth discussed in the Constitution?
How does Obamacare fit in place with the Ninth and Tenth Amendments?
I think you'd behappier in Cuba or North Korea. They still believe it can work, too.
Assume much
Assume much? How do you seem to know so much about these peoples lives? How do you know these people have all these things? How do you know they didn't have health insurance when they had kids? Maybe they got laid off?
Aren't the right considered to be strong christians? How come none of you seem to be christ like?
You're resorting to religion?
First, let's YET AGAIN bring up that point you hate: Fully one-half of the uninsured Americans are uninsured BY CHOICE. They CHOOSE to spend their money elsewhere. That is a fact that even the left agrees is true, hence the mandating of coverage in the current house bills.
You've obviously run out of ammo. You've become just the latest liberal to reach for the Bible, but only when it comes to wealth redistribution or capital punishment.
So let's go over this again: There is not a single religion in the world that commands us to give our money to the government first, to take care of our fellow man. That is **MY** obligation, not CAESER's.
I give away thousands every year. Let the government try to step in as a middle man and my checkbook will slam shut like it's spring loaded! That's purely out of self defense, because I will have a lot less money to give if this administration gets their way.
Helping people who are TRULY in need is charitable and admirable. Feeding a massive, tyrannical, bloated government bureaucracy to skim off their share and then help the lazy, inept, and those whose financial priorities are screwed up is NOT charity. It's idiocy.
First
First off, I wouldn't put my hands on the bible anyways. I prefer Alistair Reynolds or George R.R. Martin for my fiction.
How about the other half of uninsured americans? Shall we just forget about them?
I notice you are very adamant about pointing out how you give thousands every year. Does repeatedly pounding that point home make you feel better?
I have noticed how you assume that most spend their money on things they do not need.
Just a question for you on your statement "The whole half of uninsured americans are uninsured by choice." Where did you get those figures from? Did they interview all 47 million americans and audit their monthly budgets? I'd bet they asked 500 people and based it off of that.
I digress, I forgot that we "liberals" are all about taking freedom away from hard working americans and giving all the power to the government. Wait, I forgot, the republican'ts were the one to institute the greatest bastardization of our freedoms......The Patriot Act......
The Patriot Act????
Hahahaha! You really have lost it! First mewing about WWJD, now an attempt to bring George Bush and the Patriot Act into it!
Obviously you're done talking about healcare reform.
BTW, I'm no fan of George Bush (either), but challenge you to list one right you lost under the Patriot Act.
Just one....please....