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NC Senate wants merit pay, end teacher tenure

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GARY D. ROBERTSON
Associated Press

RALEIGH, NC (AP) -- Republicans in the North Carolina Senate are rolling out a package of public school initiatives they say would create performance bonuses for teachers but end their employment tenure so that districts could more easily dismiss ineffective ones.

Senate leader Phil Berger planned to unveil publicly the details at a news conference Monday. The Associated Press received an advance copy of the details of the plan, which would cost an additional $45 million in next year's budget.

The new plan would put veteran teachers on annual contracts. The proposal also would direct the 115 districts to come up with their own merit pay system in time for the fall of 2013.

The plan also would focus more heavily on making students proficient in reading by third grade.

(Copyright 2012 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.)

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I think that tenure should

I think that tenure should definitely be demolished. Most of my experience with my daughters' teachers have been positive, but there are some who have no business teaching.

When my younger daughter finished second grade she was well ahead of her grade level. In fact, her second grade teacher would give her extra work to do so that she wouldn't get bored. Her third grade teacher is horrible. When my daughter finished her class she was behind her grade level in reading and on par with her math. We aren't the only ones with complaints regarding this teacher. When my other daughter was in the ninth grade, one of the students was a problem child. Toward the beginning of the second semester he straightened up and was really trying to behave and to do well with his schoolwork. One day the algebra teacher was passing out tests she told him that giving him the test was a waste of paper. That one little comment ruined it. This year there was a book assigned that my daughter found objectionable because of foul language and explicit depictions of rape. It was something her father and I objected to as well. When she asked the teacher for an alternate book, (something the teacher had easily agreed to with a few other students) the teacher went off on her. My daughter usually takes things and let's it roll off her back. This teacher verbally attacked my daughter to the point that she had a panic attack (something that had never happened with her prior to this incident). She was hyperventilating so bad she couldn't even tell me what happened. She had to hand her phone to her friend to tell me.

These examples are only a few of the reasons that tenure should not exist in our education system.

Welcome to the real world,

Welcome to the real world, bureaucrats. Companies all over America operate on this performance based manner. And it works. That’s why so many bureaucrats are against it. They want to cushy safeness of tenure and high pay.

Poor Teacher

It is about time. There are so many sorry A$$ teachers out there and there is nothing that can be done about it. I think teacher should have to take a test every 5 years and a review to see if they still have the knowledge to teach.

Their continuing education hours are a joke. My Ex-wife was a teacher (fired because of poor performance from a charter school)and most of the classes she took to get hours had nothing to do with the subject she taught. See Charter schools have it right, they can fire you for poor performance even if you have been teaching there for 8 years.

We think every parent,

We think every parent, including you, should have to take a test every 5 years and have a review to see if you still have the knowledge to be a parent. Or better yet, maybe you should have to take a test before you even consider having children to see if you are a fit parent.

Republican Smoke Screen

The Republican led Senate proposal for the end of tenure and a 45 million dollar reading program for third graders is nothing more than a smoke screen. Neither will pass but the grading issue for teachers may well pass. Republicans want nothing more than to ruin public education. They will create a public school environment that will cause the best teachers to migrate from in favor of charter and private school positions, which republicans have always favored along with a voucher system for tax relief for the wealthy. Their proposal is more of the have and have more mentality that smells of class warfare. Our schools will once again become the haven of the well to do vs. the poor. The public schools will be home to the less fortunate along racial and ethnic lines and the teacher pool will be of the least experienced. Democrats must wake up and remove those that do not favor equal public education for all North Carolina children.

Many people across the state

Many people across the state are saying that it is about time that this happens. However, I ask that you take a minute and see the point of view from someone that is in the school and classroom everyday. We work in a profession that are sucess and failure is dependent on close to 100 other people. If I was the manager of say a Walmart and I knew that is how my sucess would be managed I would make sure the people who will help me achieve my sucess are the best they possibly can be if not i would fire them and hire someone in their place. As an educator I dont have that option. I have the students that I have. How do you rate my sucess when I have no control over who is in my classroom. I like working with the struggling students (I am an Exceptional Childrens Teacher) and so do many other teachers. However, how do you rate my effectiveness if I teach the low studets all the time, yet another teacher gets the brightest students every year. Am I less effective and dont deserve merit pay if my students dont pass the EOG yet the one down the hall has all of theirs pass. Mind you maybe all my students see growth just dont get a level 3. Maybe you say it is totally based on growth then if I am the brightest teacher is it fair to say all my students were a level 4 (highest on state test) this year they all again score level 4. You cant show growth that well becasue they were already so high. Depending how you set up the merit pay depends on what students teachers will want.
As far tenure teachers can be fired easier than most think. If a teacher is put on an action plan and does not improve they can be released from their job.

Teacher Pay

Glad to see this, past due, we don't have many teachers any more. All we have are people sucking working people dry just like the low lifes that live off welfare. Teacher work days every time you turn around, is that the only days they work? Sending hours of homework each day because they don't want to teach them at school. Working their 20 years and then retire and then go back to double dip, hard working people work age 18 to 65, or 47 years and these lazy people cry about having to work 20 before wanting us to owe them forever?
If you have a child with a little energy, then they haul your butt into the school and ask you to drug your child so it acts like they are asleep. They only work about 185 days a years, about 6 months, so it you take that into account the lazy things really only work about 10 years total before they cry about every thing, "I have to pay a little for my insurance, that's wrong" Let them get it out on their own like the rest of us. As little as they work, 6 months per year, they should have to work until they are at least 112 to put it they amount of time the rest of us do, and that's allowing us credit for doing their job every night. They cry because the don't get a raise, I would be glad to not have a raise and only work half the time, or less. The only thing that is below them as far as sucking the hard working people dry is the lowlifes that live in the projects eating with food stamps. Regular hard working people don't stand a chance in this country, it either the free loaders or the government workers taking all we make.
It's about time a 3rd party came around in this country, call it the worker's party, only allow regular workers in it, the 99% and believe me that ain't teachers.

Respect for others Profession

You seem to be against teachers. I'm not sure who taught you how to write in the first place. I don't know what it is that you do because if you are a professional, then you must have passed through a teacher's hand.

Instead of complaining this much, may be you should convince congress to do away with public school systems. That means that schools will be no longer be a right/primary need. So for those who want their children to learn then you will have to pay for the services just just like other sectors like health are being run.

I don't hear anybody complaining that doctors are paid lots of money for barely seeing you for less than 15 minutes. How about about the congress themselves? What it is that they do to deserve the hefty pay they get? How about police officers or the entire public safety?

Constructive criticism is okay but being so disrespectful about teachers's jobs only shows that you are dangerously ignorant and lack common knowledge that only a teacher can give you!

Response:

I hope your enjoy your ignorance bliss is whatever land you live in.

Sweet Jesu Christo...what

Sweet Jesu Christo...what the hell kind of teachers have you got in Bladen that are working half time? You sound like a jackass.

Workers of the World unite!

IN the new Amerika, the bigger your fail... the bigger your bail. BTW, Google the IWW and see what our Government did to the International Workers of the World...

Where is the common sense?

Too much politic has infested most aspects of our social endeavours. Fanatism now permeates most of our social lives. How stupid is to better the educational wounds of our country by punishing teachers? Every country ahead of us shows professionalism and respect toward the edudcational profession, but not in the USA. Every country ahead of us (far ahead in what matters, science, math, reading...) has a very challenging and difficult teaching program, not to say the high salary of decensy, proper of a professional. It's difficult to become a teacher in those countries because of the high regards and tough college preparation, BUT in USA most teachers graduate from the bottom 20%, a cab driver makes more money, tenure and experience are regarded as pernicious and inefficient to advance students' achievement...IF you follow this political fanatism (lack of logic)then you have to say to those countries by far ahead of us in education that "bottom 20% newly graduating teachers with barely a B.S. degree are far better and more efficient than those holding Masters' degrees and long experience" Something is terribly wrong for the future of our students. Now they rule our schools because of the low-bottom expectations our schools have created to raise students' graduation. The load/deficiencies passes on to colleges and community colleges to cover these deficiencies. Kids have played catch up with these short cuts and play along knowing they have to be promoted one way or another. Some parents make things worst by pressing on for some kids to be put on especial accommodation programs for an easier pass/grade when in fact most of these kids have discipline problems their parents are unable to address because of having not intention to. There are too many "Moses" in our politicians and school administrators who care more than anybody "for our kids" as long as they are earning six figures annual salary. The easy prey and blame for these opportunistic hypocrits are the teachers. They don't punish or blame themselves and their failed supervision/policies.

This will ensure kids run schools

I was always being threatened by students if I was disciplining them that to get me fired. I had students who would lie about a teacher without any conscience. When is anybody ever going to hold these students accountable because too many refuse to do the work and the behavior in classrooms can be outrageous. Very happy to be retired.

Finally, a common sense

Finally, a common sense approach to a very old problem.

Where is your balance?

Too much politic has infested most aspects of our social endeavours. Fanatism now permeates most of our social lives. How stupid is to better the educational wounds of our country by punishing teachers? Every country ahead of us shows professionalism and respect toward the edudcational profession, but not in the USA. Every country ahead of us (far ahead in what matters, science, math, reading...) has a very challenging and difficult teaching program, not to say the high salary of decensy, proper of a professional. It's difficult to become a teacher in those countries because of the high regards and tough college preparation, BUT in USA most teachers graduate from the bottom 20%, a cab driver makes more money, tenure and experience are regarded as pernicious and inefficient to advance students' achievement...IF you follow this political fanatism (lack of logic)then you have to say to those countries by far ahead of us in education that "bottom 20% newly graduating teachers with barely a B.S. degree are far better and more efficient than those holding Masters' degrees and long experience" Something is terribly wrong for the future of our students. Now they rule our schools because of the low-bottom expectations our schools have created to raise students' graduation. The load/deficiencies passes on to colleges and community colleges to cover these deficiencies. Kids have played catch up with these short cuts and play along knowing they have to be promoted one way or another. Some parents make things worst by pressing on for some kids to be put on especial accommodation programs for an easier pass/grade when in fact most of these kids have discipline problems their parents are unable to address because of having not intention to. There are too many "Moses" in our politicians and school administrators who care more than anybody "for our kids" as long as they are earning six figures annual salary. The easy prey and blame for these opportunistic hypocrits are the teachers. They don't punish or blame themselves and their failed supervision/policies.

Long Overdue

This is something I could definitely get on board with. I know there were reasons why tenure was implemented but it's become a bane to the education system in more ways than one. Having worked in a school district for ten years in a small rural school in NY state, I've seen the ugliest side of this, where a teacher was sexually inappropraite with a student (twice) and their hands were tied because of tenure. A relative slap on the wrist was all they could impose, after many tens of thousands of dollars to prosecute. Also the teachers who would "show up" for their workday, nothing more, while those who went above and beyond (usually the newest ones) were paid the same (or less), regardless of their contribution. Student performance MUST be put at issue as a duty of the school district (no more blaming the students): It's one thing to teach at children, a whole other thing as to whether they're actually learning.

Why do we think that it is a

Why do we think that it is a good idea to put teacher bonuses in the hands of students? If I didn't like a teacher because their class was difficult because the teacher had high expectations, I would just tank the evaluation. When our state leaders get their pay reduced and not recieve a cost of living increase for several years and then have their workload doubled, then maybe we can revisit this. How about this proposal: pay a teacher $5 an hour per student they teach each day. In the case of secondary schools thats about 100 students per day at an hour and a half per student. I agree there are too many bad teachers but just because they have tenure doesn't mean they can't be dismissed.